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Author Topic: Steering Box - 220 Sedan  (Read 5319 times)

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Offline KRK

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Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« on: August 26, 2011, 03:25:41 AM »
Folks, is there anyone who has a steering box for a 220 sedan (1952) in good condition they are willing to part with? Mycar is a left hand drive, and the current box has a reasonable amount of play in it. Thanks Richard

Offline braveman170

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  • Year_Model: 1953 170Sb
Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2011, 03:18:04 PM »
Hi,

I think that 2 different versions of steering boxes exists for the W187.


Lars
1953 170Sb W191
1967 250SE W111 Coupé
1994 E320 W124 Convertible

Offline Charles Adamson

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  • 1951 220 Sedan
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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2011, 10:44:59 PM »
The Vendor Database in the left sidebar lists a site that may restore it.

www.magnorestorations.com

Charles

Offline Henry Magno

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  • Year_Model: 1952 220 Cab B, 1937 320 Sedan, 1937 320 Combination Coupe, 1938 320 Cab A LWB
Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2011, 09:40:18 PM »
Yes there are two different versions,  and yes I do restore them. Have you tried adjusting the steering box?

Offline Des

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2011, 07:42:33 AM »
Being in Australia you might want to speak to John Green at MB Spares

http://mbspares.com.au/



Offline KRK

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2011, 09:13:30 AM »
Folks, you are correct there are two types of steering boxes for the 187 - worm and peg and recirculating ball. I have the worm and peg, and I have spoken with the folks at MB Spares and they aren't able to assist. It is possible that tightening it up may reduce the play when the wheels are straight, but I would have thought that might result in the steering becoming unacceptably heavy when taking corners. I'll take your advice Henry, and tighten it up as a trial, but will need to consider my options if that doesn't work. Do you have a kit I can buy and get installed here, rather than ship my box over and lose the car for a couple of weeks - my logic was to try and find another unit either as a donor unit, or one I can try and get rebuilt while I still keep the car on the road.

Cheers

Richard

Offline braveman170

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2011, 12:26:10 PM »
If you have the early version (worm/peg?) which I think is the same version as the 170Sb I might have one extra.

Is this your version?



Lars
1953 170Sb W191
1967 250SE W111 Coupé
1994 E320 W124 Convertible

Offline Henry Magno

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2011, 01:32:13 PM »
I don't have a kit. Only some parts are available new. I make do with what used parts and complete boxes I have on hand for the parts that aren't available new. I would adjust it with the wheels off the ground. Adjust so the tightest spot has some drag but isn't binding.

Offline KRK

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2011, 09:57:52 AM »
Lars, thanks for the photo. I have taken one of the box on my car and based on a comparison of both photos they look mighty similar, though if there is anyone out there who might have a greater level of confidence they are the same units I'd be appreciative. If you are willing to part with your 'spare' I'd be happy to have an off line chat.

Cheers

Richard

Offline Scott Montoney

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  • 1952 - 220 Cab B
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  • VIN #: 187.013.04370/52
  • Year_Model: '52 220 Cab B
Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2011, 04:30:56 PM »
Is it my imagination or is that a grease fitting that has been adapted to the top of the oil fill plug?
I wonder if someone decided to replace the oil with grease because of leaking oil?
"Gertrude" a.k.a. "Troidl"
1952 - 220 Cabriolet B

Offline John Ellis

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2011, 10:13:43 PM »
I believe that the only way you can tell is the pitman arm housing is bolted with 4 bolts.  That would show on the opposite (motor) side of the steering box or the MB cast number which is 191 461 02 41.  Here are pictures of mine which is the later version after 170V chassis number 01358/52.
John Ellis
1953 170Vb
1958 190
2007 Porsche Cayman

Offline Henry Magno

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2011, 09:08:10 AM »
This is the later version of the ZF box, model 542. There was a 540 on earlier 170's pre-Va. This is not the MB recirculating ball box used on later 220's.  This box was never used on 170's.

Offline John Ellis

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2011, 08:51:01 PM »
I looked at the parts books for all three models and the steering box for the 170V, 170S, and 220 (non ponton) should all be identical after a specific model serial number in 1952, which coincides with introduction of the 170Vb, 170Sb, 170DS, and 220 after chassis no 01358/52.  It is also confirmed in the MB Technical Data Passenger Cars 1957 edition.  They are all ZF Ross steering boxes.  The only part that is different is the pitman arm.

I don't know what happened in subsequent years towards the end of the 220 model,  perhaps they changed to a DB steering box to match the Ponton series?  Richard's question was for a 1952 model.
John Ellis
1953 170Vb
1958 190
2007 Porsche Cayman

Offline braveman170

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #13 on: September 03, 2011, 01:43:03 PM »
Hi KRK,


The steering box is found.

Images showing my steering box  part nr 542GH43.
I think it will fit your car.

The play seems ok but you need to replace the "simmerrings" (german)
It is difficult to control the play when the box is not in the car.


Lars
1953 170Sb W191
1967 250SE W111 Coupé
1994 E320 W124 Convertible

Offline Scott Montoney

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #14 on: September 03, 2011, 04:51:54 PM »
Lars,
I understand there are different models of steering box for 220, but that one doesn't look like the one in my 220.
"Gertrude" a.k.a. "Troidl"
1952 - 220 Cabriolet B

Offline KRK

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #15 on: September 04, 2011, 12:43:46 AM »
Lars, looking at these photos the box you have is different to the one in my car (not withstanding the farmhand addition of a grease nipple), and I agree with Scott. Thanks for the assistance and looking. I am going to test tightening mine up this week to see if I can get the worst of the play out of it (with new shimms), but if that doesn't work, I'll consider sending it to Niemoller (with my first born) for a refurbishment (quoted at 1100 euros).

Thanks again to everyone who has contributed and assisted me so far.

Richard

Offline Henry Magno

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #16 on: September 04, 2011, 05:03:23 PM »
Are you sure that the play is in the endplay of the worm? That is adjusted by shims. The play of the follower in the worm is adjusted by the adjusting screw on top.

If this doesn't work, I'm sure I could solve your problem for a lot less than 1100 Euros.


Offline KRK

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2011, 02:16:16 AM »
I'm about to have a play with the box - take it out of the car and examine it in detail - this weekend so will seek further advice once I know what it looks like inside and if required will be back in touch with a couple of you for some more advice, mentoring and help...

Offline braveman170

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #18 on: September 09, 2011, 12:41:32 PM »
I looked around in my neighbourhood and took some images of the boxes I found.
This is from a 220-1951.
Is it the same as the 170S version?
If so I think I have a 170S box somewhere
1953 170Sb W191
1967 250SE W111 Coupé
1994 E320 W124 Convertible

Offline braveman170

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Re: Steering Box - 220 Sedan
« Reply #19 on: September 09, 2011, 12:43:34 PM »
And this is a 170S-1950
1953 170Sb W191
1967 250SE W111 Coupé
1994 E320 W124 Convertible