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Author Topic: Looking for some Direction  (Read 155 times)

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Offline cspickel

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  • Location: USA, Oregon
  • Year_Model: 1950 Mercedes 170SV
Looking for some Direction
« on: June 13, 2020, 02:25:19 PM »
Hello everyone!  Several years ago (8 to be exact) my wife and I received my father-in-law's MB 170S Cab A.  It has not run since the early 80's and I am now in a position (thank you Covid-19!) to put some focus on trying to get it to run (baby steps!).  I decided to have someone else rebuild the carburetor and fuel pump so my focus has been trying to get everything else ready.  My current issue relates to the wiring!  There are all these buttons and indicators on the dashboard that I have no clue what their purpose is? So my first question to this forum is does anyone have a diagram or photo description of the instrument panel?  I have a feeling that some things have been added, like the start button.  The other head scratcher is the engine does not match the body style  for that year.  Seeing as they only made around 800 of this model I have found it very challenging to find any information (i.e. wiring diagrams). 

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated as my goal is to get this baby back on the road!  Thank you!

Offline Scott Montoney

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  • 1952 - 220 Cab B
  • Exterior Color: Black
  • Interior color: Red
  • Location: Mason,Ohio USA
  • VIN #: 187.013.04370/52
  • Year_Model: '52 220 Cab B
Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2020, 08:29:40 PM »
In the Technical section of this forum, you can find a PDF file that is the shop manual.
Page 250 has the wiring diagram for the 170 S.

I do not know what the dash looks like.
If it is similar to the 220, then take a look at the 220 owners manual in that same Technical section.  there is a description of the various dash controls.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2020, 08:36:34 PM by Scott Montoney »
"Gertrude" a.k.a. "Troidl"
1952 - 220 Cabriolet B

Offline cspickel

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2020, 06:41:46 PM »
Thank you the 220 manual is very helpful! 

Offline Marc1340

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2020, 06:52:50 AM »
Hello CSPIKEL

What a great story !!
You’re a lucky man ...

Just some points :
-you’r engine is not the original one ( actually you’r engine is a Va model (45 HP) and also Vb ( between april 1952)   , built on 1952) , could you check the number molded on the left side engine block  ( driver side) on that format  00x00  and alos the engine number engraved on the same side engine but most near the firewall  ( beginning by 136 ......)
- you show the picture with the frame number plate riveted ( near the grease system) ok , but you need also to verify the frame number engraved on the tube frame just under that plate ...
- you need also to verify your body number engraved on the battery box ( on driver side) witch is supposed to be the same than you’r carroserie plate number on Pillar A
Best regards
Marc



Offline Marc1340

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2020, 07:04:05 AM »
For your request


Offline Marc1340

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2020, 07:04:55 AM »

Offline Marc1340

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2020, 07:05:35 AM »

Offline cspickel

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2020, 12:23:17 PM »
Marc1340

Fantastic information, very helpful thank you!  I took some photos of the engine, see attached.  Volker has been super helpful and has helped me to find the production number 72! Let me know what you can make of the numbers on the engine.  Thanks again for your help! 

Offline Marc1340

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2020, 06:32:29 PM »
Dear  CSPICKEL

At this moment and with the help of your picture's ,  I can only said that your engine block cylinder was moulded the 16 day of april 1952 .
Without risk,  I can say also that it was not an Va but a Vb engine model ... (the Vb production beginning  on april 1952 and normally when MB had moulded theirs engine's block , the "new materialjust moulded " stay on external storage during few months for stabilize the iron cast , (I get this information from german MB worker .... )   

The picture with the moulded number 181 011...... is not interesting,  its just a parts number ...

The engine number engraved on the block 136 923 01225/52 confirm the same number than the plate 136 923 01225/52 ,  so its good and also cohérent with the moulded number ( engine block moulded on 1952 and engine number finishing by /52(1952) 

It could be better if you can do some pictures of the front of the engine ( for example , the S model had a fuel pump on the front ..; etc etc  ) or some others details ....

Sorry for your explanation of the number 72 of Volker etc etc but I don't understand .

The body plate number get none information alone ... just ended by number 72
If you have the same end of the number engraved on the steel plate of the battery box ( on driver side ) , you can say that you have a coherent body .... its all ....  but you had not given to us herby  that information (or may be to Volker)
The confirmation of that point will be interresting .

Otherwise you have to know that several bodies were produced for example in 1950 and fitted on the cars on 1951  ....  so normally (and if they want) MB can give to you some informations :
- or  with the Auftrag number ( order number) , witch is another small plate on the firewall,
- or with the identification number plate  136 042 05716 but that number need absoultly to be confirmed by the frame number normally engraved on the frame on right side ( passenger side) near the grease system under the small horizontal plate  engraved 136 042 05716 ..... That point is also important ....
 

Best regard's
Marc

Offline cspickel

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2020, 10:53:41 PM »
Marc

Thanks for your response,  I am learning so much.  I attached a few more photos.  1. of the front of the engine,  it does in fact have a fuel pump mounted to it but It is currently off the engine being rebuilt. 2. The other photo is the 72 engraved on the battery box.

This car is perplexing,  the body production is 72 which as I learned, production for the Cab A started in August of 49. So an early model body and chassis with a later model motor? 

I am going to do as you suggested and seek out some more information from MB!  Thanks again for your help!

Offline Marc1340

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2020, 04:09:37 AM »
Hello CSPICKEL

First thanks for your reply and your picture's
Second point , sorry for my poor english , i'm an young grandpa'  frenchman (I know nobody is perfect..)
Third point ,you're  a lucky man for sure and i'm sure that you'r car will be fantastic  on the future, so so , dont be perplex ...; you'r car have  a story and all story are nice to hear

-Ok for the engine front picture , but I'dont see exactly the cover witch is supposed to support the fuel pump ... normally it's a reinforced housing

Witch carburator you have ?? the carburetor is not the same between an S and a Vb model ....


But for stay on the archeology story of your car (wich is very interesting)  , on my last post , I'm writting to you : "Otherwise you have to know that several bodies were produced for example in 1950 and fitted on the cars on 1951  ....  so normally (and if they want) MB can give to you some informations :
- or  with the Auftrag number ( order number) , witch is another small plate on the firewall,
- or with the identification number plate  136 042 05716 but that number need absoultly to be confirmed by the frame number normally engraved on the frame on right side ( passenger side) near the grease system under the small horizontal plate  engraved 136 042 05716 ..... That point is also important ..."
If you want to have more information on your frame , check that point ...


On my opinion and also as you know probably on MB system  (on years 1950th ),  the body's are built on one place and the assembly is done another place . So mean that sometimes the numbers of the body is not cohérent with the number of the frame .... As i'd try to explain to you,  some time the body is built on 1950 and may be could be fitted on the car (by the factory..) on 1951 but on you'r case its not changing so much the story

- other point of view  : the total production of cabriolets A & B  together on S models are
-1949=     39 ex
-1950= 1686 ex
-1951 =  708 ex
Nobody ( even the company may be ..but not sure also) know exactly how much A or B models on détail are built each year ( and year by year) .... but for sure with a number 72 , you'r car as been product on 1950 or 1951 , naturally I'm thincking on 1950 (wich is matching with your ID plate)

-as the chassis are different beween S cab A and S cab B  and Sedan models , on my opinion  you need to check what type of chassis you have on your car  ....

Ok , ok I can writte to you all the day !!!!!   I return to my customized  170S ...  have a nice day
Best regard's
Marc


Offline Marc1340

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Re: Looking for some Direction
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2020, 02:17:42 PM »
 ;)